Lee Freeberg

David W Ebel: Welcome to the God Says Yes Podcast. You are welcome here. Welcome back to another edition of God Says Yes. I'm David Ebel. I'm your host. After 50 plus years of ministry, we're usually dealing with people who need a little encouragement or they've been through a lot. Whether they've been betrayed, belittled, be somethinged, or they thought they were gonna go one way and things didn't go that way, or they lost a job, or whatever it is, or even church-herd, for one reason or another, they pulled away and they're not living the life that they really want. to live for God or they've just given up on living for God because they're concerned that if they trust God too much that they might get hurt again and they're not prepared to be hurt again. And I can understand that. what we're here for today is to meet people where they're at. To love you as you are. To remind you that God created you to love from the inside out. that you're custom made. You don't look alike because he didn't try to make us all look like rubber stamps. We're all to be unique, but we're custom made one at a time. And from the inside out, we are to be like Jesus, and that's His perfect desire for us. So He can lead us and guide us and heal us and direct us and meet our needs. He can also help us to get past the wounds of life, including church, where people sometimes forget that the church was designed to be the emergency room of the body of Christ, not the social club. And when people come in, some come in that are really wounded and they get well fast. Others come in and they know they need help, but they don't know how and they don't know why. And they act out. And unfortunately, some of those are the people who make it hard for the church to not get hurt. And on behalf of one of the believers, I apologize for those knuckleheads who haven't got it together and that hurt you. But the reality is God is not who you need to blame. Those people are the ones who failed, not God. And God has always been there for you. He never leaves you or forsakes you. He's with you always. And that's why we're here. We want you to be reminded about that always. And to do that, I brought with me my brother Lee. And Lee is going to share today. And we're grateful that Lee is going to ⁓ tell us his story. So Lee, you just welcome and would you give us a little bit of an intro? Sure. Thanks, David. ⁓ Awesome. Thank you, David. So I am a Navy veteran. I was in the Navy for eight years. I've been a Christian since I was about five years old. I've done many different things in my life ⁓ from being a medic to being a mentor to somebody who helps create courses, works with other men to build men up from the weak place that the world puts them back to strong masculine men. And then I also do a few other things like design products, write books and things like that on that scale. Yep. So I, I, I've been married for about 16 years. I have an eight year old little girl. She's about to turn nine in a couple months or so. ⁓ we live in Southwest Missouri. Been down here for about three years. Kind of a, on the path that God led has been leading me. He brought us down here through a series of events. ⁓ when people look back at 2020 and talk about, how bad it was, ⁓ to me, I see that as God was like. really opening a lot of doors. He was making a lot of moves in my life during that year. So ⁓ from his grace, I was able to build to where I'm at now today. Excellent. So what we'd love to hear from you is a little bit of who you were before Jesus, know, what Jesus did for you and then what happens next. Yeah, you bet. So, so I was adopted at two days old. My parents were Christians. They were told that they couldn't have children. And so they put all their paperwork in and God, I mean, God had his hand in my adoption from the people, day, time, all of it, everything. God was in the works. My parents were getting discouraged, hadn't heard anything, and so they went and bought clothing. baby clothes and laid them out on the bed and they prayed over the clothes and asked God to fill those clothes. And that was one month before I was born. And so God has had his hand in my life since I was, before I was even born. A few years ago, I got the opportunity to meet my biological family and hear their stories and hear how they grew up and what they were experiencing. And when i look at her stories and i and i sat with them i ever praise god because of his hand uh... i could have ended up in jail or even dead how do i stay with my biological family but in god's timing will uh... he had my parents that you know they adopted me and so it was always easy uh... when i was about five s i guess i was about closer to ten the church that we attended had a church split. And I'm sure many people have been through church splits before, and it's always a human event. It's not a divine event. And so the church we went to split. had a Christian school at the time, and so that kind of got moved off and whatnot ever. My dad was ⁓ one of the primary people for the new church to take over as the pastor, and it was between him and another young man. And my dad just believed that God was leading us somewhere else. And so he took us to Minnesota for about seven months. We helped with a church planter out there, build this church, but we just could not find a place. And it was very evident to us that God wasn't planning on leaving us there. And about seven months later, after we moved there, we ended up moving back to Wyoming and started attending a church, a little storefront church there in Wyoming. My dad was working for a trash company as a mechanic. help in the church, grew the church, worked with that church. We eventually moved out into the country, bought a building, had a whole building. God was really blessing the church. And of course I was coming of age and ⁓ I was saved when I was about five years old. And this is something that I've always thought about, especially in Christian families. We've gotten away from discipleship. so far away from discipleship, especially in a pre-mother-father Christian home. We see this, they send their kids to Sunday school and to Wednesday night Iwanas and all the kids' clubs expecting them to learn of God there, but not at home. And that was pretty evident in my home when I was a kid. ⁓ They really expected the church to teach me. to be a Christian. They really expected the church to give me morals and values. Mom and dad are busy at home, and so I wasn't discipled properly, is what I'm trying to say. And because of that, I had a lot of unanswered questions, which then in my mind allowed me to do whatever I wanted with my life. Now, when you read the Bible, it does say that once you're saved, you do live in liberty. And I, in... I believe you can't send yourself back into a center. Once you're saved, you're always saved. That's the way that I believe. But it doesn't mean you live like it's a daily choice. And so you have to choose to live for God every single day. And as I grew up, it wasn't that way for me. ⁓ Yeah, my parents were Christians. We were the model Christian family. Yet I lived the way that I wanted to live in my own heart, in my own life. Eventually one day I joined the Navy, went off, I guess technically I joined the Navy in 2000, went to boot camp, and for the next eight years I lived the life of a sailor. I did whatever I wanted. As long as I obeyed the rules of the Navy, I did whatever. And I believe that God gave me grace in those years. When I was a young boy, my prayer to God was, want to be wise. Lord, make me wise. I want to be wise. And when we read about Solomon, and Solomon asked God the same thing, Lord, I want to be wise. If you could give me anything, give me wisdom. And so God allowed Solomon to do lots of things that we consider to be sin. And I believe Solomon didn't experience the consequences necessarily, God gave him the ability to live the life that he wanted so that he could learn what life, this life, the thing that we do, we're living, is all about. And then he wrote a book called Ecclesiastes and he tells us all those things out in the world are just vanity and stress, vanity and stress. And I can confirm that. Because when I was in the Navy, I lived like a sailor. I did sailor things. I had a mouth like a sailor. While some might be like, well, Lee's on a sinning path. Lee's back slid and God's not taking care of Lee. No, God's forgotten all about Lee. On April 13th of 2007, I was on a mission with an explosive ordinance disposal team. I was their medic. And we were on what's called a road clearing convoy type event. And we'd been working since 6.30 in the morning. Blowing up roadside bombs searching this stuff out things like that And about midway through the afternoon. I guess it's technically about one sometime between one o'clock and two o'clock in the afternoon We got into a firefight with some insurgents and one of our humvees pulled off the main road Off onto a dirt road and as soon as they got off on the dirt road an IED blew up Send the the humvee flying about 40 yards through the air like an airplane and it nosedived right into the ground. I ran out the back of my vehicle. I was in a big up armored vehicle and I was the team medic so it was kind of my responsibility. So I ran out the back door. I don't really remember much from the door to the vehicle other than looking into the hole of the IED and thinking to myself, that hole is so deep I could climb in it and nobody would see me. Like if I had to dive for cover, that hole was deep enough. Ran past it, found the driver, put the driver out. Me and the driver, I'm looking at the driver, I'm checking him out. His arms, from elbow to tip of his fingers, look like a snake when it's molting. You know how the snake skin is just kind of holding on, but it's not technically attached? That's exactly what his arms look like, both arms. Face, all his hair was singed, his eyebrows were singed. ⁓ But he was fully functioning, talking, breathing, and we're standing there talking. And he looks at me and he says, Doc, we got to move. I said, why? He says, we're being shot at. I said, really? And I looked down and the bullets are ricocheting off the vehicle and hitting the dirt around us. We're in an open battlefield, being shot at, not being hit. God was presently standing there with me. I sent him back to my vehicle and I went on to the driver who'd been thrown out of the vehicle. He was laying face down in the dirt and I thought, my goodness, this dude's dead. So I run over there, I check him out, still alive. I ended up having to ⁓ pull him and another Marine into a building. Cleared the building by myself, I was the only one with a firearm. Those two Marines are still alive today, by the grace of God. And I know God was in that field with me. Well, just because he was with me there doesn't mean I suddenly started serving him. I went right back to my good old Navy life that I was living before. And I believe he wasn't too happy with me after that. Because after I got back from deployment, I was gearing up to go on in my next deployment with the same team or same unit. And God just started shutting doors. Took me off the deployability list. Pretty soon I was on med board. Pretty soon I was being examined by doctors and physicians and psychologists and whatever. And within about eight months, less than a year, I was out of the Navy. My entire career in the Navy. And I'd already been in eight years. You know, and that's, I only had 12 more years to full retirement. Well, just because God closes some doors doesn't mean he forgets about you. I got home from the Navy and most veterans go to the VA and they get their service disability rating. Basically, they just say, we beat your body up. We're going to take care you for the rest of your life up to a certain percentage rating. The VA rated me. Now, I thought I was about 30%. I was on my way home from the Navy thinking, I'm going to get 30 % from the VA. That's a little bit of healthcare, a little bit of extra change, and I'm going go have my own life. And I got home and the VA had rated me at 90 % disabled. Wow. Every joint, socket, ball, flange, everything, all I experienced pain from time to time. And the VA documented all that. I twisted my ankles. which was a pretty common thing in the military because you do a lot of running. They're covered. Shoulders covered. Neck covered. Sinus infection covered. And I was like, this is amazing. like I'm not even serving God and he's over here like blessing me with like, with abundance. like it wasn't enough to like retire on, but it was enough to where over 50 % of my daily needs. My daily bread was covered already by this compensation. so once I got out of the Navy, I went and got a job like most vets do. I I supposed to do security work, so I'm like working security into mine. And there's a few bumps and roads here. I couldn't find a church, so I was driving about four hours to a church that I knew of. Because after I got out of the Navy, then like this like this identity of the sailor, it was gone. It was like, I don't need to cuss anymore. I'm not around those people anymore. I don't need to smoke because I'm not around those people anymore. I don't need to drink because I'm not around those people anymore. I'm not in that lifestyle anymore. And so I started going back to church and I started giving up smoking and drinking and carousing around. And while I'm not like living a hundred percent for God, Like he's calling me. You know, I come back, come back Lee, come back. And so through a series of events, I eventually got married, met my wife, got married. ⁓ A few doors here and there, open and closed along the way. He put us in a church in South Carolina and we worked in this church and the pastor was very greedy. And so he used church money. to satisfy his desires and use different reasons. Eventually, God took us out of that church, moved us somewhere else, and we ended up moving to Colorado, to Loveland, Colorado. And we were looking for a church and life's kinda happening there a little bit. We ended up going, finding this, another storefront church with a young guy who came out from Ohio to start this church. And... So we started tending, God's just kind of blessing there, so we just keep staying. Nine years go by. We'd help build this church, help grow this church, things like that. Eventually one day the pastor started the church, he moves away. God calls him back to his original home church and God brings in another man. In that church we were serving, I mean we were serving a lot, we were trying to be in, we were choir, we were teaching kids, things like that. But my heart wasn't right. Even though, because I think that as a young, as a, child of Christian parents and growing up in church, you really become accustomed to the, I'm going to say the mask that you put on when you go to church. You get used to not really telling everybody the real truth of what you've been doing. You don't, you're used to not like hanging out with church people because you know, everybody kind of has like Maybe I don't I'm overstepping my bounds here, but I think but I think people get at this point in our lives now in our history as humans we've become so jealous of our own time in our own home that we forgot to be friendly and we've forgotten to be inviting and to have others come in and Be be a church body, you know like being one being a group, being supportive of each other. Eventually I preached a message at this church in June of 2024 called The Storms of Life. In that sermon, I preached on the different storms throughout the Bible and how they reflected on my life, like how my life compared to these stories, to what the Bible said. The first story that I preached on was, or the first storm, the first storm was Jonah. Jonah has been told by God, go do this thing. Jonah decides not to do it. He goes his own way. And so he gets in the boat. Eventually God has to bring him back. God has to do drastic things in Jonah's life to get his attention. I believe God kicked me and my family out of Colorado. We couldn't find jobs. Our landlords sold our house that we were living in. Things were just coming to a close. It was too expensive to even buy a home. And so I believe God kicked me out of Colorado because I just wouldn't sell out 100%. I was just still just drifting, just coasting through the Christian life. I had lots of friends, but only maybe a handful of them knew that I went to church. You know, like I just wasn't being the witness I was supposed to be. I wasn't being a godly man. I was doing things that pleased me. Like I sought pleasure more than I sought his glory. And so in 2020, God closed all the doors and literally we, I had to move my family in, into my grandparents basement. We didn't know what to do. thought God was calling us to Tennessee. But really, I think God was just trying to get ahold of Lee, like, hey, Lee, wake up. And so I went on a few road trips in 2020, drove all over the United States. Spent a lot of time praying, talking to God, thinking, ⁓ going places. And God led me down a road that led me to a college that taught machinists. And it was a 16 month program. Could not find housing anywhere around this, but I knew God was wanting me, was calling me to go to him, be a machinist. And so I was like, Lord, if this is the direction you want me to go, you got to open the doors. And he did. He started opening doors. Had two college options. One of them failed, like one of my prerequisites. So I ended up going. limited down to one school. And so we ended up moving to the, to Seward, Nebraska, ⁓ and ended up going to a school in Milford, Nebraska called, ⁓ Southeast Community College, where I learned to be a machinist. And there was a church there. Of course, you know, like for me, when I move, like there's gotta be a church where I go. So, ⁓ we moved there, there was a church in that town. Went to, I was going to school, we were attending church, ⁓ which was really interesting because this is the first time. Now I gotta say it the first time. I like when God makes it obvious. You know what mean? Like, when He wants me to do, please just make it obvious. Just make it so obvious. If you don't want me to do it, make it just that obvious too. Exactly. And so I have not joined churches before because I believe God did not want me to. He wanted me to be there, but not to... Formalize? Yeah, formalize. Formalize my alignment with this church. And so when we were going to this church, it was a family-run church. The dad was the pastor. The son, a couple of the sons were the deacons. One son was the song leader. The family ran the whole church. And me and this pastor, started building the friendship. He was in the Air Force, I was in the Navy. ⁓ We shared a lot of common experiences, things like that. So we would have lunch about once a month and chit chat about things. And him and I were talking about some stuff, what not. This actually kind of has ⁓ some alignment with the direction I'm going with my life. I'm leaning towards and working on being a Christian man. Christian man's life coach. And that's the direction I'm headed in my life. And I'm working on that constantly, currently, things like that. And some of it stems from these times when I got to be an advisor to godly men. And I believe God has given me wisdom to make discerning ⁓ answers, to look at situations and be able to say, yeah, this is good, this is bad. things like that, he's given me that ability. And so I want to be able to use that ability to help others grow the church, be a coach for men, lead Christian men. And so me and this pastor were meeting together and he's telling me a situation and he's like, Lee, what do you think I should do? And at the time he was working a full-time job and being the pastor. And I asked him, said, do you have faith in God? Like, do have faith in God? And he says, well, yeah, I'm a pastor. And I was like, no, no, no, I'm serious. Do you have faith in God? And he's like, yeah, I have faith in God. I said, quit your full-time job. You have faith in God, quit your full-time job and watch what happens. So he did. He put in his official retirement paperwork. He retired from his job, started, met, my goodness, every message from there, just started becoming. like a hundred percent better, deeper, like deeper into the word, explaining. like I, I'm the person was getting things out of these messages. And then one Saturday morning, I think it was like in 21, 22, maybe he dies from COVID. He'd been sick like 48 hours and he was dead. Just like that, God took him. And I was like, that's just amazing. wow, that's like, he had the faith. He stepped out by faith. He said, okay, God, I will depend on you. And he started preaching and God took him home. I was like, that's crazy. We stayed with the church for a little bit longer. They eventually found ⁓ another pastor candidate. He came in and again, one of the gifts God has given me is this ability to ask the right questions at the right time. And so this church has a meet and greet with the What's that? What do call those guys? The not interim, but the ⁓ candidate that there's a question answer time with a candidate and, ⁓ people are asking him questions and things like that. And, and I start, you know, asking him some serious questions about his beliefs and about how he lives and things like that. one of the young men from the family, one of the brothers comes over and sits down next to me and says, Hey, we've already asked him all these questions. said, right. But I haven't heard the answer. The other family members haven't heard the answer. We want to hear the answer. And he's like, well, let's just make it short. Like, OK, no problem. So I asked him a couple more questions. No big deal. They all vote him in. The very first Sunday, these people have a strict music standard. Their dad was a, he was actually an Air Force conductor for like the Air Force band. So he. He would write songs, compose songs for the Air Force band. So his family was really big into music. The first Sunday this new preacher preaches, he comes in with, ⁓ no, what I'm about to say is I have nothing against it. In his first service, he set the music standard ⁓ with ⁓ audio track, with percussions, which was very odd for this other, anyways. God eventually moves us away from there, moves us down here, opens all the doors, moves us to here. And about six months later, they kicked that pastor out. They kicked him to the curb. And I tried to tell, like God was like, Lee, be a little aggressive. Ask these questions. Shake the bush. Find out what's in the bush. If people won't listen, It's not me, it's not on me. But I'm gonna do what God asked me to do. And so I did. I asked him all these questions. And I believe that had the family stopped and just let me ask my questions, that they wouldn't have eventually voted him in. Because it turns out his standards and their standards weren't the same. And so. We can't obviously go back and fix that, but we can look at it and learn from it and say, okay, well, we ended up moving down here. God opened all these doors, let us down here, took care of us through the hard times. And I'll tell you, we lived for a year with no physical jobs. Not my wife, not myself, went to a physical job, but God covered it. God covered all our bills. He set us out on the path. And it was in that time that he, you know, there's a, verse that says, draw an eye to, draw an eye to God and God will draw an eye to you. And I believe it was in that year, like you talk about when, the, when, when, when somebody like makes that connection back to God and begins to strive with God or like to seek after God, it was in that year that I began to seek after God. And God gave me time because if I had had a nine to five job, I would have to get up, go to work, come home, you know, do all that good stuff. But I didn't have a job. So what do I get to do? Will I get to get up early? Early will I seek thee, right? And so I got up 6.30 in the morning. I would go for walks. ⁓ I would joke to myself, it's my walk with God. I've got to go do my walk with God. I'll be back in however long. And so for 45 minutes every morning for this year, I would walk and talk with God as if he was next to me. And then I'd come home and I'd read my Bible for about an hour. ⁓ I still didn't really at the time what I was doing was designing a machine. The school I went to was to become a machinist. So I am a machinist by trade. But in that school, I also got to learn how to use them. I designed software, some program things. so God has given me a talent to be able to design and create different objects for my imagination. Matter of fact, I designed a firearm, an AR-15 lower receiver. I designed one, took it to a machine shop, had it machined. And it's an actual functioning ⁓ product. And God has given me these talents and these skills. And so for this year, I was... working on designing things, going for walks with God, reading my Bible, eating healthier than I've ever ate in my whole life. And God really started to open up doors and really started to me things. Well, I don't go anywhere, I don't move anywhere unless there's a church there. And so, of course, there's a church here where we live. And would you believe that it's a storefront church? I have a pattern, I think. So we started going to this ⁓ storefront church, small ⁓ early year church, early years. And there was a ⁓ two, two couples. There was an older couple, the pastor had started the church and there was a young man and his wife and they had two kids at the time. And they were excited because they had not had like people who stayed guests who'd stayed. And we, when I went there, I was like, let's do this. Let's get to work. Let's win people to Christ. That's what we're here to do. Let's get after it. And so they had their little programs that they worked on and stuff like that. We just integrated ourselves in. Hey, how can we help? How can we be part of this? And you you talk about getting hurt in church. Everything was going really well for a while. But this young couple, there was a problem. They... would exclude us from things. They'd exclude my family from things. ⁓ Their daughter would lie to our daughter. And then we can say something about it and there was no correction. And so it was a little concerning. so obviously ⁓ some other events happened. I don't want to get into details about it, but there was a clear sign. And so I went to the Word, I to the Scriptures, and what do I do? What does God want me to do? Of course, I went to like Matthew 18 where it talks about how you deal with a brother, right? If you have a problem with a brother, what do you do? Well, you go to him first and you say, hey brother, we've got a problem. Let's fix this. And so that's what I did. I went to the brother and said, hey brother, we've got a problem. He says, we have no problems. I said, are you sure? He said, we have no problems. I said, okay, because we're seeing things that's concerning. Nope, no problems. I said, okay. Couple months later. the problem finally came to a head. And... followed the scriptures, the way the scriptures said, so now I went to him, he didn't, nope, so now I bring a witness. So I went to him, brought a witness, said, hey, we've got a problem, we need to solve this. And he continued to, matter of fact, he began to lie in front of the witness and me. And I said, hey man, you need to be careful lying in front of a witness and God at the same time. He's, oh, I'm not lying. Blah, blah, blah. I said, okay. Well, I don't, I can only from my experience, you know, like I, this is only my side. Well, the problem was became, it's kind of like, uh, when you pick it, you start picking at a scab and then the scab gets infected and then it gets bigger and the hole gets bigger. Well, it continued for a week, a week long event of a young man who was full of pride. could not overcome himself. ⁓ And we prayed for him, we prayed, I mean, like, just go to the church and just pray for him. eventually there was, now there's only three families in the church at this point. And so it wasn't like a church split, but it came to the point where this young man was just, He was beside himself. He thought that he was in the right, that we were attacking him, and he had this impression that he was the anointed man of God, and it became a big deal. And at one point he says to the pastor, he says, well, Paul and Barnabas had a problem, and the pastor looked at him and said, yeah, and you never heard of one after the problem's over. You should be careful what you're saying. Well, the young man, he found a way to get over himself, came back to church, but the problem didn't go away. And so we continued, me and my family, continued there working, and we could tell it was just getting worse and worse. So eventually, one day, I'm working, I have a job at that time, it's a Friday afternoon. Get off work, I'm headed home, had about an hour long drive. And I'm just praying in the car right home, like, Lord, know, you know what's going on with us. You know, the situation, you know, like what do we do? You tell me when you want us to leave this church. And like I said earlier, I love it when God just makes things plain as day. I mean, God can make a clear answer, just as clear as crystals, right? Like, so Sunday comes around, Sunday morning comes around and something inside me said, Lee, leave your family at home. I said, okay. So told the wife and the kid, said, you guys are staying home. It's your lucky day. don't have to go to church today. What? I want to go see my friends. Like, no, no, not today. So go to church, Sunday school, regular church services over. At the end of the main service, the pastor calls all the men into a room. And he says, well, Lee, I think it's time for you and your family to move on. And I said, pastor, you just answered a prayer. Like I just literally been praying and asking God, God, when do you want us to move on? Friday. Less than three days later, he'd given me a clear answer. Amen. And I'm very grateful for that. ⁓ We ended up going to another church for a while. ⁓ God didn't like, no, he say he wanted us here for the time being. Matter of fact, we were like trying to move. close to this church. a pretty good church. In the first three Sundays, we saw two young men get saved and ⁓ some young girls get baptized. In like the first month, we were like, ⁓ my goodness, like this place is on fire. Lord, move us up here. Like, we move up here? And we looked and looked and looked and God would not open a single door. I mean, we had our loan, all of it. God just wouldn't open a door there. And so about halfway through the year last year, I start getting this like a calling, calling, like there was something that was pulling on my heart. Like I could feel it. And said, okay, Lord, what is it? And he was like, I want you to go back to the little church in your town. And I said, really? I drove by on a Wednesday night. I didn't go in, just drove by just to see who was there. The other young couple weren't there, but the pastor was there. And so I stopped in, had a little chit chat with him for a little bit, but didn't come back Sunday. We went to a different church on that Sunday, but the calling was still there. And so eventually about August timeframe of last year, I just told the family, I said, we're going here this Sunday. And they're like, what? I was like, yeah, we're going there. We're going back to this church. And we've been there ever since. God brought in a new pastor. He removed the young couple, the other couple that was there. The young, the, the pastor he brought in has actually six kids, all about four of them, all within the same age range as my daughter. And so it's like God's preparing this church for something great to come. and he's assembling the men that he wants in this church. And so me and this pastor, we've been out knocking on doors and fighting people. Matter of had guests at our Wednesday night service, we had guests and it was pretty exciting. so ⁓ God is leading in this area. He's leading in my life and I'm trying to just stay open and willing to do whatever it is that he wants me to do next. so. Is this where I get to plug my stuff in? Almost. This is where I ask a couple questions first. The first one is, as a result of what you've gone through, how would you encourage others to get past their wounds and hurts and move forward for God? Okay. I believe you mentioned that earlier and a thought came to mind. So I'm going go back to that thought. I think sometimes we get wrapped up in the idea that a church or going to church is the Christian life. And Christians put their identity in the church that they attend. the religion, the brand, I'm gonna call it the brand of church, Baptist, Pentecostal, Church of Christ, whatever. They put their Christian identity in that. And when that doesn't work out, because a church is made up of, what did you say? People. And so when the church eventually has problems, because all churches eventually have problems, the Christian's identity is fractured. because it's in the church body itself, in their brand of church. But really, in reality, being a Christian is a personal relationship with God. It's not how much money I gave in my offering. It's not, I work in Sunday school. No, it's my relationship with God. I can attend, now not everybody can say this and I know a lot lot of Baptist, if you Baptist are going to be listening to this, they might be like, what? I personally believe you can attend any church you want to. If you're getting closer to God in that church, then you're in the right church. If God is calling you to that church, then you're in the right church because that's where God wants you to be. But outside that church, God, wants you and him to have a close relationship. And so if your church is falling apart, maybe you need to check your relationship with God. If your relationship with God is good and the church is still falling apart, well then maybe God is either asking you to step up and help be the... I was gonna say the problem, but that's not... He wants you to be part of the solution. or it's time for you to go somewhere else. step up or step out. That's right. Yep. And that came through the just this like series of learning. Now, as you can see up here, I wrote a book in 2020. I wrote a book called How to Live a Better Life. And throughout that book, I cover several different topics, but I have a topic on just it's called the chapter is called a preach. a priest, a monk, and the son of a preacher boy. And it's an entire chapter dedicated to knowing who God is. And in that chapter I cover things like the modern God. And the modern God is whatever we worship the most. I believe that people have turned their TVs into God. They've turned their car into God. They've turned their job into God. They've turned money into God, to their God, little G. And they pursue after that. But we know that there is only one true God. And it's that relationship that you have with Him specifically that matters more than the brand of church that you go to. But then on the same note, Whatever brand of church God has called you to be a part of, be a part of it. Be active. Be involved. Do something. Don't be a sucker fish and just suck up all the good of being there and go home to your selfish life. Be actively involved. I believe this as a human, our highest achievement outside of God that we can do is give back. Taking what we've learned, the grace that God has given us and giving back to those around us. Being loving and being kind, being an example of who God wants us to be. I believe that is more important than the name on the church. or the pastor or how many, how much tithe you give. I 100 % believe that it's your relationship with God that's more important. And why do I know that? Because I've had to live it. Amen. Well, brother, I'm grateful for you coming on and sharing your life. ⁓ And you, I was, normally we asked for a golden nugget, but you just gave us yours. So we, you, you, you, you, you beat me to the punch for once. That's all right. But I'm grateful that you came and you know, you, you've mentioned your book. You have a website that you want us to look at as well. Yes, it's under construction right now, but it's going to be called theleberg.org. And on that website, you'll be able to hear about my books. You also, I'm working on a one-on-one coaching program for men to help men come from the drift from like this, I'm just living life, just getting by to, hey, I'm making a difference. and I'm changing the world based on the way God wants me to do that. And so that site, the leighberg.org will be where men can come. I've already developed a course, a full 12 video course on what's called the Ordered Life. And it's a faith-based course based on biblical truths about living an ordered life. And God is order and Satan is chaos. Amen. Well, it's been a powerful and wonderful opportunity for you to share. You know, it's interesting because I love the opinion that the label on the door means very little. If we give our hearts to Jesus, we are part of one body, the body of Christ. The building that God places us in is how we reach out to God, God through His Son Jesus and His Holy Spirit is how He reaches man. So whatever building he places you in, it's part of our worship to serve there. So I agree that the service is a really important part. I believe that God's work, personal relationship, living for Him, and moving forward in serving are powerful parts of a solid Christian life. And I'm grateful that you've covered those things in your story. It is time now for us to get ready to close in prayer and we're grateful for your being on and folks, I'm going to pray and then I'm going have a closing challenge for everyone. So let's pray. Heavenly Father, we're grateful for the privilege we have to be together. We're grateful that your word is true and that you lead us and guide us wherever we need to go. Lord, we ask that you be very clear in speaking to our hearts and our minds. so that we know what you want us to do. One of the wonderful things about your Word is that if it's in your Word, we can trust it. And you'll lead us and guide us into all truth. Lord, we ask that you make it clear to us what your plan is for our lives. Through your Word, through our prayer life, through all the things that we do, that we would know your will and do it. For those that are listening and viewing today, if you are likely and you've been through this church and that church and trying to just find where you belong. Don't give up just because people are there. We know that people come to church many times to get healed because their life is just chaos. Lord, be there and calm the chaos, heal the hearts. And Lord, heal the hearts of the people so that they can serve you wherever they go. Bless this effort to the glory of God and Speak to the hearts that have you to listen and do something that shows your love in it. Jesus' Amen and Amen. Now the challenge is, seek after God. He will be found. You want to know more about God? Jesus is the way. Ask Him, He'll show you. This has been the God Says Yes Podcast with David Ebel. Connect with David, email him at Godsaysyespodcast.com. You can get his latest book, When the Doctors Say No, God Says Yes, at Amazon.com.